Discussion:
What economists have gotten wrong for decades
(too old to reply)
Steve Carroll
2019-07-28 15:54:46 UTC
Permalink
Skeeter
2019-07-28 15:55:21 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Jul 2019 14:28:57 -0000 (UTC), Steve Carroll <"Steve
On Sun, 28 Jul 2019 14:08:11 -0000 (UTC), Steve Carroll <"Steve
Also, a warning to everyone else: the Carroll k00k is now playing
silent-followup-to games in a desperate attempt to have the last word by
dishonest and sneaky means. Be cautious and make sure to restore any
snecked groups when replying to prove him wrong yet again.
I have no idea what you're talking about.
I believe she may be referring to the Kensi Method of Discussion®,
where she will reply in a totally different, renamed thread in an
effort to make the conversation difficult if not impossible to follow.
But I don't recall seeing you do that.
I guess I should ask the obvious... is "kensi" just another Snit sock?
I've seen people claiming "kensi" is a she but some of the arguments are
*very* much like those Snit puts up.
It's entirely possible. There are similarities. It may be one of
Snit's "transwoman personas" where- as Big Dog postulated- an overdose
of lavender oil resulted in the nascency of Kensi. I suppose one could
trace her usenet activities if one was so inclined.
I recall seeing someone referring to her as a female and so I did the
same and there was no protest. However, Kensi is very confused by sex
and gender so it's hard to tell. Most leftists seem like women anyway.
Kensi/Nads is Paul Derbyshire from Pembroke Canada. He/she/it will post
a "proof kook" response but it has been proven many times.
I thought the Nadega or whatever it was was similarly stupid. Paul,
eh? Canada explains a lot.
Sure it's not "Pauline?"
Oh, was this the one who claimed to have a PhD is physics or
something?
Kensi <Nads> claims such but has yet to provide an inkling of proof.
Also the fake FNVW known as Libtard is also a sock of the infamous
Nads/Kensi sybian riding duo.
I will have to go through my filters and make sure none of those are
being ignored! LOL
https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/alt.free.newsservers/aRYJrLEg03Y
That's our kicktoy.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 15:57:22 UTC
Permalink
Many of these teens are in a group together and I have talked to the leader
and there will be a focus on some of the things you bring up. The school
“sex ed” is a joke. Will not go into more details in part because Carroll
might figure out what group and harass them.
So this "group" has a "leader"?

So now you invite gang members in to your house. Very interesting.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 16:11:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Skeeter
Many of these teens are in a group together and I have talked to the leader
and there will be a focus on some of the things you bring up. The school
“sex ed” is a joke. Will not go into more details in part because Carroll
might figure out what group and harass them.
So this "group" has a "leader"?
The group many of them are in — yes. Most youth organizations do. No, I
will not be more specific and help Carroll track them down and harass them.
Post by Skeeter
So now you invite gang members in to your house. Very interesting.
You cannot think of any youth focused groups other than gangs. That in
itself is scary.
You allow young children into your house and discuss gay and lesbo
stuff. In most places that would cause an investigation. I shall report
this behavior.
Klaus Schadenfreude
2019-07-28 16:15:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Skeeter
Post by Skeeter
Many of these teens are in a group together and I have talked to the leader
and there will be a focus on some of the things you bring up. The school
“sex ed” is a joke. Will not go into more details in part because Carroll
might figure out what group and harass them.
So this "group" has a "leader"?
The group many of them are in — yes. Most youth organizations do. No, I
will not be more specific and help Carroll track them down and harass them.
Post by Skeeter
So now you invite gang members in to your house. Very interesting.
You cannot think of any youth focused groups other than gangs. That in
itself is scary.
You allow young children into your house and discuss gay and lesbo
stuff. In most places that would cause an investigation. I shall report
this behavior.
When you do, let them know we've been unable to confirm if Snit is
armed or not. Tell them to prepare for the worst, given his mental
health issues. Once he begins huffing essential oils, there's no
telling how he'll react to a simple knock on his door.
Steve Carroll
2019-07-28 15:57:49 UTC
Permalink
Snit
2019-07-28 15:58:26 UTC
Permalink
<https://abcnews.go.com/International/guatemalan-mother-begs-soldier-enter-us/story?id=64570713>
We may not want to believe it's possible but this woman could be the
mule carrying the biological agent that would've been released into the
local reservoir near Snit's drinking water (if karma is a thing ;) I'm
only half joking here... what do you suggest we do? Is there no middle
ground in your mind?
Hevonpaska.
Seriously, this is your argument? "<science fiction scenario>, therefore
we should suspend habeas corpus?"
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty, to purchase a little
Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
      - Benjamin Franklin
He later backpedaled
If true, you should be able to show where I 'frontpedaled', right?
So let's see a quote where I claim people have no right to remain silent
(which is silly on its face because you can't *make* someone talk).
To 'kensi': I thought the asking of this hyperbolic hypothetical was
rather obvious but I'll clarify it for you, it was written in an effort
to ascertain the OP's thoughts on the level of restriction on the CBP
(but that doesn't mean I don't consider security job #1 of my gov't).
Regarding Franklin's famous quote, I'd submit that the "those" being
referenced are not members of the group known as "ourselves" in the
preamble of the U.S. Constitution. I'm assuming that this is among a
number of things recognized by the SCOTUS when giving something like the
border search exception a green light... the same goes for things like
Clinton's IIRIRA (even the 1st Congress recognized the need for border
searches and how they might rub up against the Constitution). To your
"habeas corpus" statement, Clinton already did that with the AEDPA.
Of course... I figure, at some point, you'll be forced ro recognize
reality.
pointing out evil acts by Clinton or Obama
as if this somehow means you win.
What would (or did I) "win"?
I don't know why I must keep repeating this, but: Clinton was not a
saint. Obama was not a saint.
The point here is, they're realists... all those who sat as POTUS and
remained silent about things like this know what part of their job is.
IOW, I believe that this doctrine does *not* 'follow the U.S.
Constitution' (providing we give full 4th Amendment protection to
non-citizens)
We should. Indeed, we must. The Founders did.
? The Founders prescribed a head tax, the idea of giving millions who
want to cross a bunch of free stuff would be appalling to them. (the 1st
Congress implemented methods to collect the tax).
The entire Bill of Rights
hardly even mentions "citizens".
The reference is "the People" or "We the People" as seen in the
preamble... *those* "people" are U.S. citizens. In the preamble the term
"ourselves" is used in the context of *why* the Constitution is being
written. The idea that "We" (any version of it, for any country on the
planet) can prescribe a legal doctrine that applies to *all* "people" on
the planet is off the chart loony... it's not merely child-like (only a
very young child might suggest it) it's flat out loony. You realize
that, right? Are you a U.S. citizen (or a citizen of *any* country that
uses Constitutional law)? If yes, you *should* know this basic aspect of
reality (read: fact).
It enjoins the *US Government* from
doing a wide variety of things *to anyone*.
The Bill of Rights is an incomplete list of the rights of U.S. citizens
that the "*US Government*" is charged with protecting, as such, it has
*nothing* to do with people who are *not* U.S. citizens. That the gov't
has decided to afford non-citizens certain rights is not as strong a
guarantee as it is to citizens. IOW, the "Bill of Rights" didn't do what
you claimed, some version of the Congress/SCOTUS came along *later* and
said, 'OK, we'll give *these* rights to non-citizens'... but the "Bill
of Rights" doesn't say squat about non-citizens.
Notably, this means even
people living in foreign countries far away (thus making "extraordinary
rendition" unConstitutional, among other things).
I know what it means and, unlike you, I'm also aware that it was the
You left out how all people are created equal. All. And how you excluded
darker skinned people — citizens or not — in your view of “we”, saying it
was acceptable in your view to profile people by race as non-citizens.
You also insist you have the right to not self incriminate when the police
question you about your harassment of others but say people of other races
should be forced to self incriminate on threat of being detained.
You backed yourself in a corner again so out came your attacks and your
socks and your use of the N-word and more.
Time for another of your public breakdowns.
Carroll snipped and ran. Of course.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger. They cling to their attacks
and ignore the message time and time again.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 15:58:33 UTC
Permalink
For kids with parents like you — my house is s place they can be sure they
are safe at.
I am willing to bet Epstein said the same thing to his"children".
Snit
2019-07-28 16:06:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Skeeter
For kids with parents like you — my house is s place they can be sure they
are safe at.
I am willing to bet Epstein said the same thing to his"children".
Irrelevant. But the fact Carroll has said that child abuse is not, in his
view, a crime unless you are caught is.

Notice how you do not call him out on that.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger. They cling to their attacks
and ignore the message time and time again.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 16:12:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Snit
Post by Skeeter
For kids with parents like you — my house is s place they can be sure they
are safe at.
I am willing to bet Epstein said the same thing to his"children".
Irrelevant. But the fact Carroll has said that child abuse is not, in his
view, a crime unless you are caught is.
Notice how you do not call him out on that.
Because he never said that, you did. You admitted to being like Epstein.
Snit
2019-07-28 16:21:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Skeeter
Post by Snit
Post by Skeeter
For kids with parents like you — my house is s place they can be sure they
are safe at.
I am willing to bet Epstein said the same thing to his"children".
Irrelevant. But the fact Carroll has said that child abuse is not, in his
view, a crime unless you are caught is.
Notice how you do not call him out on that.
Because he never said that, you did. You admitted to being like Epstein.
Remember, Carroll is responsible for his own words... EVEN IF you deny it.

It is not my job to get you to be reasonable.

Steve Carroll:
-----
Notably, it isn't considered child abuse until it's been adjudicated...
-----

He is 100% wrong. Child abuse happens without anyone outside the family
knowing about it, no less it ever being adjudicated. People commit all
sorts of crimes -- including misdemeanors and felonies -- without being
caught, tried, and convicted.

But Carroll wants to pretend his own actions are fine unless he is found
guilty in a court. In the past he has spoken of "law worship" -- his
moral development never grew past right and wrong being based on what
the authority finds out.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 15:59:14 UTC
Permalink
<https://abcnews.go.com/International/guatemalan-mother-begs-soldier-enter-us/story?id=64570713>
We may not want to believe it's possible but this woman could be the
mule carrying the biological agent that would've been released into the
local reservoir near Snit's drinking water (if karma is a thing ;) I'm
only half joking here... what do you suggest we do? Is there no middle
ground in your mind?
Hevonpaska.
Seriously, this is your argument? "<science fiction scenario>, therefore
we should suspend habeas corpus?"
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty, to purchase a little
Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
      - Benjamin Franklin
He later backpedaled
If true, you should be able to show where I 'frontpedaled', right?
So let's see a quote where I claim people have no right to remain silent
(which is silly on its face because you can't *make* someone talk).
To 'kensi': I thought the asking of this hyperbolic hypothetical was
rather obvious but I'll clarify it for you, it was written in an effort
to ascertain the OP's thoughts on the level of restriction on the CBP
(but that doesn't mean I don't consider security job #1 of my gov't).
Regarding Franklin's famous quote, I'd submit that the "those" being
referenced are not members of the group known as "ourselves" in the
preamble of the U.S. Constitution. I'm assuming that this is among a
number of things recognized by the SCOTUS when giving something like the
border search exception a green light... the same goes for things like
Clinton's IIRIRA (even the 1st Congress recognized the need for border
searches and how they might rub up against the Constitution). To your
"habeas corpus" statement, Clinton already did that with the AEDPA.
Of course... I figure, at some point, you'll be forced ro recognize
reality.
pointing out evil acts by Clinton or Obama
as if this somehow means you win.
What would (or did I) "win"?
I don't know why I must keep repeating this, but: Clinton was not a
saint. Obama was not a saint.
The point here is, they're realists... all those who sat as POTUS and
remained silent about things like this know what part of their job is.
IOW, I believe that this doctrine does *not* 'follow the U.S.
Constitution' (providing we give full 4th Amendment protection to
non-citizens)
We should. Indeed, we must. The Founders did.
? The Founders prescribed a head tax, the idea of giving millions who
want to cross a bunch of free stuff would be appalling to them. (the 1st
Congress implemented methods to collect the tax).
The entire Bill of Rights
hardly even mentions "citizens".
The reference is "the People" or "We the People" as seen in the
preamble... *those* "people" are U.S. citizens. In the preamble the term
"ourselves" is used in the context of *why* the Constitution is being
written. The idea that "We" (any version of it, for any country on the
planet) can prescribe a legal doctrine that applies to *all* "people" on
the planet is off the chart loony... it's not merely child-like (only a
very young child might suggest it) it's flat out loony. You realize
that, right? Are you a U.S. citizen (or a citizen of *any* country that
uses Constitutional law)? If yes, you *should* know this basic aspect of
reality (read: fact).
It enjoins the *US Government* from
doing a wide variety of things *to anyone*.
The Bill of Rights is an incomplete list of the rights of U.S. citizens
that the "*US Government*" is charged with protecting, as such, it has
*nothing* to do with people who are *not* U.S. citizens. That the gov't
has decided to afford non-citizens certain rights is not as strong a
guarantee as it is to citizens. IOW, the "Bill of Rights" didn't do what
you claimed, some version of the Congress/SCOTUS came along *later* and
said, 'OK, we'll give *these* rights to non-citizens'... but the "Bill
of Rights" doesn't say squat about non-citizens.
Notably, this means even
people living in foreign countries far away (thus making "extraordinary
rendition" unConstitutional, among other things).
I know what it means and, unlike you, I'm also aware that it was the
Snit snipped and ran.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 15:59:35 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Jul 2019 14:08:11 -0000 (UTC), Steve Carroll <"Steve
Also, a warning to everyone else: the Carroll k00k is now playing
silent-followup-to games in a desperate attempt to have the last word by
dishonest and sneaky means. Be cautious and make sure to restore any
snecked groups when replying to prove him wrong yet again.
I have no idea what you're talking about.
I believe she may be referring to the Kensi Method of Discussion®,
where she will reply in a totally different, renamed thread in an
effort to make the conversation difficult if not impossible to follow.
But I don't recall seeing you do that.
I guess I should ask the obvious... is "kensi" just another Snit sock?
I've seen people claiming "kensi" is a she but some of the arguments are
*very* much like those Snit puts up.
Ah, now you run to your lie about me using socks as you do. You backed
yourself in a corner and are lashing out. Another of your very public
breakdowns.
Hi Joel.
Skeeter
2019-07-28 16:00:26 UTC
Permalink
I'm saying, among other things I've mentioned, if you stunt CBP from
ascertaining necessary info or insist on full 4th amendment protection
for non-citizens it's tantamount to an open border. If an agent has no
reason to hold a jumper he didn't see cross the border then we have a
huge problem.
If he didn't see this person cross the border, then he cannot assume
that that person is a "jumper". Without some sort of probable cause.
Incorrect. As I've already pointed out, the standard is *lower* than
What standard did you insist applied to you when you talked of the police
speaking to you about your harassment of others?
He wasn't found wandering around the border.
Snit
2019-07-28 16:06:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Skeeter
I'm saying, among other things I've mentioned, if you stunt CBP from
ascertaining necessary info or insist on full 4th amendment protection
for non-citizens it's tantamount to an open border. If an agent has no
reason to hold a jumper he didn't see cross the border then we have a
huge problem.
If he didn't see this person cross the border, then he cannot assume
that that person is a "jumper". Without some sort of probable cause.
Incorrect. As I've already pointed out, the standard is *lower* than
What standard did you insist applied to you when you talked of the police
speaking to you about your harassment of others?
He wasn't found wandering around the border.
That does not answer the question. But since you bring up the border, given
how about 65% of the US population lives within 100 miles of a border, and
about 75% of Hispanics, why should they not be free to “wander around”
where they live?
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger. They cling to their attacks
and ignore the message time and time again.
Snit
2019-07-28 16:02:03 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Jul 2019 14:08:11 -0000 (UTC), Steve Carroll <"Steve
Also, a warning to everyone else: the Carroll k00k is now playing
silent-followup-to games in a desperate attempt to have the last word by
dishonest and sneaky means. Be cautious and make sure to restore any
snecked groups when replying to prove him wrong yet again.
I have no idea what you're talking about.
I believe she may be referring to the Kensi Method of Discussion®,
where she will reply in a totally different, renamed thread in an
effort to make the conversation difficult if not impossible to follow.
But I don't recall seeing you do that.
I guess I should ask the obvious... is "kensi" just another Snit sock?
I've seen people claiming "kensi" is a she but some of the arguments are
*very* much like those Snit puts up.
Ah, now you run to your lie about me using socks as you do. You backed
yourself in a corner and are lashing out. Another of your very public
breakdowns.
Carroll snipped and ran. Of course.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger. They cling to their attacks
and ignore the message time and time again.
Steve Carroll
2019-07-28 16:05:46 UTC
Permalink
Snit
2019-07-28 16:14:46 UTC
Permalink
That aside, do you think it's appropriate to counsel kids about topics
their parents might prevent them from being counseled about
"Appropriate"? Try "necessary". If the parents are neglecting to educate
their children on an important topic then it falls to the rest of
society to ensure that those children do not fall through the cracks.
It is even more basic than that. If one of my kids’ friends notes they have
a crush or is dating someone there is no reason for me to take notes and
make sure their parents know.
Now if they are in a dangerous situation, say dating a teacher or other
older person or whatever, of course I would take action. But for Carroll to
think teens having crushes is something weird and something I need to act
in is insane.
Many of these teens are in a group together and I have talked to the leader
and there will be a focus on some of the things you bring up. The school
“sex ed” is a joke. Will not go into more details in part because Carroll
might figure out what group and harass them.
And keep in mind Carroll has said that child abuse, in his view, is not a
crime unless one is caught. And has talked about his estrangement from his
kids and how multiple wives have left him. He is likely projecting his own
abuse of kids into me.
Ideally, the public school system would ensure every important topic was
taught, and would enrol 100% of the population, but there's this whole
"home-schooling" and private schooling thing, especially in the South,
fuelled by a mix of a) bigoted parents who want their kids to go to an
all-white school, b) profit-driven interests wrecking the public school
system and selling an alternative, and c) misogynistic or otherwise
fucked-up parents who specifically want to keep their offspring ignorant
about sexual matters particularly, usually religious kO0ks, and all of
these factions have outsized political clout.
There is a lot of that — but there is also good home schooling. Some
parents want their kids to learn more than the schools teach. If the kids
also are in library groups or sports or scouts or the like research shows
they often do better academically and socially. Takes a strong commitment
from the parents though.
Every *real* developed country, of course, has a universal education
system and a government that responds to bigoted, misogynist, or
otherwise evil or misguided parents' complaints by telling them to go
pound sand. The United States, by contrast, has governments at every
level that bend over backward to appease the most backward, ignorant,
and reactionary citizens in their districts, and also sky-high rates of
teen pregnancy, STDs, and other problems as a consequence.
Colorado handled this well and reduced their term pregnancy and abortion
rates. The right wingers, of course, are against everything they did.
Also, a warning to everyone else: the Carroll k00k is now playing
silent-followup-to games in a desperate attempt to have the last word by
dishonest and sneaky means. Be cautious and make sure to restore any
snecked groups when replying to prove him wrong yet again.
And this includes his sock explosion. He is having one of his very public
breakdowns. He cannot defend the US engaging in bigoted profiling — but
backs it anyway. He cannot defend the US abusing kids (and adults) as a
part of the redistribution of wealth to the rich — but backs it anyway. He
cannot defend his demanding of rights for himself he denies others. He
cannot explain why child abuse is not, to him, a crime unless you are
caught.
So he is doing what he does when he backs himself in a corner — lashing out
with horrid and false accusations and fishing for personal info about
people to use in his harassment.
Carroll snipped and ran from this babbling about me being a "counselor".
I am not (well, I used to be a camp counselor but I doubt that is what
he meant!). Carroll also lied about my views of history, of books, and
more. Just his normal non-stop lies to try to turn the tables away from
his own comments about how child abuse, to him, is not a crime unless
you are caught.
--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.
Crunchy Coder
2019-07-28 16:14:52 UTC
Permalink
That aside, do you think it's appropriate to counsel kids about topics
their parents might prevent them from being counseled about
"Appropriate"? Try "necessary". If the parents are neglecting to educate
their children on an important topic then it falls to the rest of
society to ensure that those children do not fall through the cracks.
It is even more basic than that. If one of my kids’ friends notes they have
a crush or is dating someone there is no reason for me to take notes and
make sure their parents know.
Now if they are in a dangerous situation, say dating a teacher or other
older person or whatever, of course I would take action. But for Carroll to
think teens having crushes is something weird and something I need to act
in is insane.
Many of these teens are in a group together and I have talked to the leader
and there will be a focus on some of the things you bring up. The school
“sex ed” is a joke. Will not go into more details in part because Carroll
might figure out what group and harass them.
And keep in mind Carroll has said that child abuse, in his view, is not a
crime unless one is caught. And has talked about his estrangement from his
kids and how multiple wives have left him. He is likely projecting his own
abuse of kids into me.
Where did Steve Carroll say that?
Do you have a msg-id or is this just another one of your lies?







I never said anything of the sort
Klaus Schadenfreude
2019-07-28 16:16:49 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Jul 2019 12:14:52 -0400, Crunchy Coder
Post by Crunchy Coder
That aside, do you think it's appropriate to counsel kids about topics
their parents might prevent them from being counseled about
"Appropriate"? Try "necessary". If the parents are neglecting to educate
their children on an important topic then it falls to the rest of
society to ensure that those children do not fall through the cracks.
It is even more basic than that. If one of my kids´ friends notes they have
a crush or is dating someone there is no reason for me to take notes and
make sure their parents know.
Now if they are in a dangerous situation, say dating a teacher or other
older person or whatever, of course I would take action. But for Carroll to
think teens having crushes is something weird and something I need to act
in is insane.
Many of these teens are in a group together and I have talked to the leader
and there will be a focus on some of the things you bring up. The school
“sex ed” is a joke. Will not go into more details in part because Carroll
might figure out what group and harass them.
And keep in mind Carroll has said that child abuse, in his view, is not a
crime unless one is caught. And has talked about his estrangement from his
kids and how multiple wives have left him. He is likely projecting his own
abuse of kids into me.
Where did Steve Carroll say that?
Do you have a msg-id or is this just another one of your lies?
Sounds like a SnitLie®.
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